The Astronomical Society of the Toms River Area
ASTRA club message board

It is currently Sat May 30, 2020 6:50 am

All times are UTC - 5 hours


Forum rules


This message board is for A.S.T.R.A. Members and visiting Guests. Astronomical and Star Party messages are welcome. Those who post are responsible for their content. The board is monitored by the Webmaster, who has the discretion to remove any posts. The Webmaster is accountable to the club officers. Please follow responsible message board etiquette.



Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 9 posts ] 
Author Message
PostPosted: Mon Sep 28, 2015 6:18 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Nov 13, 2011 4:39 pm
Posts: 2405
Location: Gilford Park
http://gregorysamsblog.com/2015/09/22/t ... -delusion/

Quote:
Why are otherwise conservative evidence-based scientists declaring the existence of [dark matter] when they haven’t got the foggiest clue what it is? Perhaps there is another way of looking at the problem that dark matter would solve. That problem lays in the movement of stars within their galaxy. If they are all just balls of matter being moved around by the gravitational force of a big black hole in their middle then the stars at the edge of the galaxy should be moving much slower than the ones near the middle. They are not. That’s the problem.


In short, dark matter is being taken on faith with little empirical evidence. Why not stars with a will?

IMO, he goes a little bit off the rails towards the end but there is a good point made here.

_________________
Interdum taurus est victor

Chris S.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Sep 28, 2015 6:19 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Nov 13, 2011 4:39 pm
Posts: 2405
Location: Gilford Park
- Star Consciousness: An Alternative to Dark Matter http://www.centauri-dreams.org/?p=23203

Going a little more in-depth on the topic of volitional stars is George Matloff, drawing inspiration from Olaf Stapledon's Starmaker.

He touches upon the concept of dark matter and the problems surrounding it, despite the fact it's supposed to be solving a completely different problem. A violation of Ivan Sanderson's maxim, "Don’t try to explain one unknown with another unknown." It's a mistake most people make when they're researching fringe topics but mainstream science falls into this trap too.

Greg goes on to explain the problem of stars moving faster than expected at the rim of the galaxy, in contrast with stars closer to the galactic center, before dipping his toe into stars actually being conscious. This idea isn't entirely crazy, viz an abstract posted at arXiv by Max Tegmark at MIT in January 2014 proposing Consciousness as a state of matter.

http://arxiv.org/abs/1401.1219

Matloff presents his theory of stars being conscious, utilizing psychokinesis, and the quantum physics that may be at work here. This is half-mystical, half-scientific with the evidence supporting his hypothesis. For people who are materialists, embracing this hypothesis does away with Decartes's separation of consciousness, uniting it in the physical world without any extracorporeal aspects.

And the idea isn't new, having been researched at MIT during the 1970's.

_________________
Interdum taurus est victor

Chris S.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Sep 28, 2015 6:19 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Nov 13, 2011 4:39 pm
Posts: 2405
Location: Gilford Park
- Greg Matloff: Conscious Stars Revisited http://www.centauri-dreams.org/?p=33995

Matloff recapitulates the material covered in his article from 3 years ago before presenting more evidence of volitional stars. He's found more inspiration with Parenago’s Discontinuity where cool, low-mass stars in our galactic vicinity move around the center of the Milky Way a bit faster than their hotter, higher-mass companions.

Many of the alternative hypotheses presented to falsify Parenago's Discontinuity, and stars as conscious entities, have been falsified. The possibility remains equally valid as dark matter, if not moreso. The theory is too simple, Matloff writes, to get much traction from mainstream researchers. Also the stigma of being affiliated with the likes of Uri Geller keeps scientists from investigating the matter more closely, with the possibility of upsetting the current cosmological paradigm.

_________________
Interdum taurus est victor

Chris S.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Sep 29, 2015 12:21 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Oct 12, 2011 8:57 pm
Posts: 641
If it's true that people are not bound by physical laws and have free will, then why shouldn't we expect stars to be conscious and have free will as well?

_________________
Matthew M.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Dec 29, 2015 12:50 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Oct 12, 2011 8:57 pm
Posts: 641
I assume that all people with active and fully developed brains are conscious. Yet this doesn't necessarily mean that we can use our consciousness or free will to change the laws of physics. At least we have no scientific evidence to indicate that this can be done.

If stars are conscious, shouldn't they, like us, follow the laws of physics? If so, then we still need a scientific explanation to account for what's going on. Possible solutions might be to detect the presumed dark matter or revise the theory of gravity.

_________________
Matthew M.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Dec 29, 2015 8:31 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Nov 13, 2011 4:39 pm
Posts: 2405
Location: Gilford Park
> Yet this doesn't necessarily mean that we can use our consciousness or free will to change the laws of physics. At least we have no scientific evidence to indicate that this can be done.

Going completely off the rails here, as I'm certain there are staunch materialists in ASTRA who bruck no nonsense.

Look at the research performed by the Princeton Engineering Anomalies Research. They have intriguing data of mental phenomena affecting the physical world with reproducible results of six sigma scores. If mental phenomena is proven to affect the physical world, then everything we understand could be called into question, opening up unthinkable possibilities. The issues challenging PEAR's findings may be in methodology, but I can barely make heads nor tails of their published papers, let alone the mainstream research I scan at arXiv since I'm scientific laity.

Your mileage may vary.

_________________
Interdum taurus est victor

Chris S.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Jun 18, 2017 8:49 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Nov 13, 2011 4:39 pm
Posts: 2405
Location: Gilford Park
Is The Universe Conscious?

https://www.nbcnews.com/mach/science/un ... ncna772956

_________________
Interdum taurus est victor

Chris S.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Fri Apr 26, 2019 6:04 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Nov 13, 2011 4:39 pm
Posts: 2405
Location: Gilford Park
Probing Parenago: A Dialogue on Stellar Discontinuity

https://www.centauri-dreams.org/2019/04 ... ontinuity/

_________________
Interdum taurus est victor

Chris S.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon May 04, 2020 5:55 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Nov 13, 2011 4:39 pm
Posts: 2405
Location: Gilford Park
Strange Stars Pulse to the Golden Mean

https://www.quantamagazine.org/variable ... -20150310/

_________________
Interdum taurus est victor

Chris S.


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 9 posts ] 

All times are UTC - 5 hours


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 9 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
cron
POWERED_BY